Don't Back Down: Be The Change in The Wake of Prop 8 Ruling (video)
Since the California Supreme Court decision almost two hours ago, I have been trying to stay focused on work and get to the many things I have sitting on my desk waiting for my attention, but have been stewing inside and wanting to write a rant-type of blog to vent my frustration over this all-too-common blow of a decision.
But then, I got an email from HRC and watched this video (below) and realized that while anger and frustration is definitely a normal reaction, the passion and energy needed to get anything accomplished needs to be refocused and put in the right direction to really make a change.
We cannot stop fighting! Those concerned with equality for ALL must come together and continue to work for what should be afforded to every citizen of this country. Please watch this video and do what you can and what you personally determine will help to make a difference. Steve and I make monthly donations to the HRC and I also donated extra today, in accordance with what we could afford right now. I know that in this economy, that money is tight, so if that's not possible, donate your time and your energy in any form possible.
While it's hard to remain positive in light of disciminatory mindsets, it's essential to concentrate on the change that simply MUST come. We need to educate the ignorant and choose love and equality over fear and bigotry.
BE THE CHANGE THAT YOU WANT TO SEE!
Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 11:43AM
Reader Comments (50)
That made me cry. I am so appauled by this decision, and that in 2009 it is still an issue. I just have so much that I want to say, it's better if I leave it at this. Anger serves no puropse. ACTION does.
I will protest at my school this week because you inspire me. Thanks so much!
This is not over. We need to vote out discrimination of any type from any law! Bigots irk the fook out of me! Have the easily deluded come to their senses yet? This type of discrimination should be barred from the ballot in the first place, and discriminatory laws should be struck from the books.
It is just so unbelievable to me that this issue exists. May the children of these bigots grow to to be gay and proud.
Amen, Julie!!!!!!
Someone said that calling Prop 8 a hate-based issue weakened the argument against this type of discrimination. Here’s my reply:
On the surface they surely don't play it as anything to do with hate, in that they'll claim it's for the love/grace/will of God and protection of the sanctity of marriage, and many of the sheep believe that too, but the disdain/hate stems from the religious leaders that use the enemy as the focal point for their argument. They believe that Satan has corrupted the minds and souls of not only gays and lesbians but of all non-Christian infidels and blasphemers, and they will do anything, including control freaking everyone's lives to win the battle against the hated enemy of evil.
Hate may not be the only factor involved, since some religious leaders may FEAR their own gay tendencies and lash out thinking they're doing themselves some good in denial, but I think the root emotion is typically based in hate for anything that goes against their Christian beliefs. They HATE the idea of their children being taught about same-couple marriage, even though their children will get that information regardless. Many HATE the idea of same-couple sexual activities, regardless if girl-on-girl is more socially acceptable. Many HATE the idea that their precious definition of marriage is threatened, even though they do not own the global definition of marriage. Sure, hate maybe too strong of catch-all word, but I don't think it weakens the argument. Discrimination is a hate crime.
Here's a blog that gives a strong indication that same-sex unions were not only celebrated by the early Christian church, but that they also did not hate the idea of making same-sex couples saints!
Look for "The Lost Rite"
http://blogs.myspace.com/imminentmike
The Lost Rite
@ Maxwell
I agree with your excellent points. Discrimination is a hate crime. Whether it it cloaked in the god package and wrapped up with bows and ribbons of "love" and "sanctity" what lies beneath is still inequality and hate.
I believe that Jinxi did a blog about same-sex marriage and the Christian church earlier this month ----
http://www.jinxiboo.com/blog/2009/5/3/when-same-sex-marriage-was-a-christian-rite.html
@ Julie and Jamie Baby
I third that
Oh really. But we, as Christians, can be discriminated against and it's okay? And dont' say it doesn't happen, because it does. Everywhere. We are ridiculed, we are insulted, and we, too, are discriminated against. So if you want me to stop discriminating, ridiculing, etc. gays, then you dang well better stop doing it to Christians. And Christians, true Christians, do not HATE people--we only despise the sin. There is a HUGE difference. You can hate or dislike your child's misbehavior, but does that mean you hate or dislike your child? NO. We do NOT hate ANYONE, only the wrong doing, and true Christians I know of do not speak ill of people's wrong doing, only provide them with the truth and let them make up their own mind. There is a lot more hate speech towards Christians on this blog than I have even seen in my life against gays.
@ James...
That blog about the early church may have said that gay marraiges were celebrated back then, but the early church has a history of adding their own theories where they see fit by taking scripture out of context. Find me one scripture used IN CONTEXT where it says homosexuality is okay.
If you see something that says some kind of church, or the early church, that doesn't mean it is true. The BIBLE is what is true. So just because " the early church celebrated these marraiges" doesn't mean it's okay. It's not in the Bible. Find me one verse where a gay couple was married in the Bible. Quote it book, chapter, and verse(s). And don't use the David/ Jonathan story found in the OT because that has nothing to do with homosexuality. Those two were closely bonded friends who made a pact to help each other-they were not gay.
@ Lisa
Hebrews 13:4 - "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge."
You say: "discriminating, ridiculing, etc. gays" -- YOU = hate!
I think it's sad that you would ridicule anyone for who they love. How pathetic that you believe in "eye for an eye." wow
@ Lisa
Most of your comment is not worth responding to. Already spent hours upon hours discussing this topic with you and you clearly will not open your mind up enough beyond your world to understand.
However, I must point out that any talk on this site that is bad about Christians is not because they are Christians, it is because those being discussed are bigots. If I was talking shit about David Duke, I doubt you would classify me as being derogatory towards Christians.
Hate may be a trait of many Christians, but disagreeing with a Christians hatred does not mean we are haters ourselves. However, you are speaking the typical talking points of the religious right. Claim to be that which you are guilty of yourself.
Oh and it almost sounds like you are preaching eye for an eye. I have asked this question and you have never really given a good answer before. If Christians make up 85% of the United States and this is a "Christian Nation" then how is exactly that you are so discriminated against?
Ok Lisa, how about you 'find me scripture' on this site that shows non-believers spewing hate speech. Who is discriminating against you? Because we don't believe in mythology doesn't mean we hate you, but when bigotry comes into the fold, we have a right to speak out against it. I have read about you being upset about being a teacher in these times, I have read about you being discriminated against because you are christian, and I have read about how you can't stand being called homophobic. After reading all of that, I would say to you: "relax, open your mind a bit, and don't be so scared of hurting gods feelings".
@ Frank....
That is NOT in CONTEXT. You are using ONE verse to support your view. This verse is stating that the marraige bed needs to be kept pure, and undefiled, to avoid adultery, for if there is adultery, there is God's judgement. When the marraige bed is kept pure, the marraige is honorable.
@ Steve...
I am discriminated against, as well as fellow Christians: we were not allowed to have a Bible Study in school on our own time. All we wanted was to get together during study hall on our own and discuss the Bible. We wanted it at school because we were all from different churches and didn't have a lot of time outside of school with sports and activities. We are discriminated against because our churches are being forced to allow all this crap that is not scriptural into them. We are not allowed to talk about our beliefs at the workplace; if a student comes up to me and asks about God, I can't even answer him. We are not allowed to share our faith in public places--other organizations can be out and about, walking around, handing out pamphlets, we are not allowed to do this for our church and beliefs. We are being forced to accept homosexuality as right, we are being forced to accept that people can still have abortions and be a Christian and involved in activities in the church, we are being forced to silence our opinions and views; if I am talking about my views and why I am not for gay marraige, I am shot down verbally and called a bigot--you are guilty of this. This qualifies as hate speech in my opinion. Name calling just because someone doesn't believe what you do. That goes for the word homophobic. Since when does being against gay marraige mean I'm afraid of gay people?
I'm not afraid of anyone--I am however afraid that my beliefs and everything I hold dear will soon no longer be permitted because of other people who are intent on pulling the thread of Christianity, so to speak. Once one thread is pulled, the rest quickly follows. If gay marraige is allowed, who's to say that doctors won't be forced to perform abortions, even if it goes against their morals. Then, who's to say that a person killing in self defense won't be in prison for life because it's murder, even though it was for protection. Then, who's to say that it'll be okay to beat your wife because she made you mad. The sweater is starting to unravel. If you are not familiar with end times prophecy, you will have no clue what I just said in this paragraph, but it's the best analogy I could think of. And dont' say that just because you read the Bible means you are familiar with end times prophecy. My pastor has been studying the end times prophecy for YEARS' it takes a lot longer than one or two readings to "get it" when it comes to this subject. Back to the point at hand....
we are trying to preserve what we know and believe is the truth before we are no longer allowed to preach our beliefs without being killed. Is that discrimination? Killing someone because of what they believe in? You bet. But guess what. It's in the Bible. It WILL happen, when? Nobody knows-except the Father. Does that sound like a loving God? He is a loving God who is losing patience with the world and we will suffer for His cause just as His Son suffered through His death on the cross. All this will be done to spread the Gospel. It's already happening in some countries--and the church is growing by leaps and bounds as a result. And I am going to stick by that belief, as scary and hurtful that it is because that's what a TRUE Christian does (sticks by the word of God) and I know that my reward will be great someday. If you don't believe me, read Matthew 24 (the whole chapter), read the Book of Revelation (the entire thing--watch out, it can be confusing). Read Daniel, Ezekiel, Thessalonians, parts of Isaiah. You'll see what I mean.
Steve again...
No, I won't open my mind to more than I believe because that would be allowing the devil to take over my thoughts and allow deception to creep in. And you are not opening your mind either, to take my comments to heart and try to understand where I'm coming from. You say you read the Bible; my question for you is: How in the world do you come up with the idea that someone just made it up? Especially since there are historians in this world who are finding evidence that it did happen. CS Lewis set out to disprove Christianity and in the end got "saved" himself-he turned into a Christian. And why do you read it? Is it because deep down, it makes sense and you find some comfort in the words of the Bible? There must be a reason you read it. As to your comment about how "85% of this nation is a Christian", I'm going to quote your phrase from an older post "cafeteria Christianity." Most of these people who claim to be Christian take a little from here and a little from there; I however do not. I take the entire Bible into account. Don't you think I would love to change what it says about Christian persecution and the end times? heck yeah. I'm terrified of what could happen if I am still around when those events begin to unfold. But I'm accepting it as the truth because God says it will happen. Most of the people who say they are Christians are not "by the book" Christians. They are Christian by name only. I am proud to say that I am NOT one of them.
@ Tiger....
I am NOT going to relax about the Biblical teachings. I WILL be accountable to God someday for my actions, so I will NOT support something that goes against scriptural truth. I wasn't going to get involved again because nobody can see it from MY perspective and I guess if you're an aetheist, you won't get it anyway (from my view), but for some reason, I just couldn't keep my nose out of it.
Lisa, when is 'end times'? It's been a long time a comin'
How about we call people who aren't 'afraid' of gays, but want to keep them down "against gays"? because that's what you are, right? "against gays, gay rights"?... I would define that as BIGOTRY. Pure and simple. And if I am atheist, doesn't mean I haven't looked at it from your side, I have an OPEN MIND and have looked at it from your side throughout my life off and on, and after accumulating much knowledge, it's all a myth to me.
As far as the rest of the post....whoa!!! is there such thing as a Shiite Christian? seriously.
@ LIsa
What? You ramble way too much. You think that you cannot go out and preach to people on the street. What the hell does Ray Comfort and Kirk "The Idiot" Cameron do? How about the guy who knocked on my door a few days ago and gave me a track. You are crazy if you think that Christians are not out and about spewing their evangelism everywhere, everyday.
I find it very interesting that you follow your pastor so much. He seems to guide you in every part of your life. I did not realize that you were given the power by the Christian god to decide who qualifies as a Christian. Wow, that is some job you have. Oh and historians are proving it, hahahaha. Which ones, please send me their names and links to the articles. I would love to read them. I have challenged you to give me one piece of evidence that JC even existed as a historical person.
Oh and you think that "the church" is growing by leaps and bounds, ahahha. Really, by "the church" do you mean the Muslim church, because in about 10 years they will be the biggest faith group in the world above Christianity.
End Time prophecy. Please, that shit has been prophesied for centuries. Do you know that every generation thinks that the end times will happen during their lifetime. The one before ours, the one before that and back and back and back. The signs have always been there, why you ask? because situations can always be twisted to fit into ones plan for the end times.
For the record, I am a bigot when it comes to people who are bigots. I do not like them, in fact I hate them, they make me sick. I accept it. I am disgusted by racist, homophobes, speciesist and a number of other things.
As for giving you one verse that supports homosexuality, I have pointed out to you that the verses used against homosexuality are misrepresented. You use them out of context. You were not able to refute anything that I said to you about this issue.
As for you talking to a student about god, how would you like it if your child (once you have one) went up to a teacher and asked about god and the teacher started talking about Satan and how great he is. How would you like that? In that context, don't you think that perhaps it should just left out of schools? Are you able to see how this issue could get out of hand, if teachers were allowed to teach religion as they see fit. Or is it that you think your version should be taught.
Perhaps, your school does not allow bible study during breaks because the other teachers complained that you were calling them all fake Christians. I doubt it was the one in the closet atheist who complained to the Christian (be it "fake" or real christian) principal.
CS Lewis, hahahahahahaha, enough said.
I would love for you to tell Matthew Shepards parents that homosexuals are not discriminated against.
Most of your comments are the rants of a crazy person. I am sorry to be so blunt. You need to find a new church, your pastor seems to be loopy.
STOP DRINKING THE KOOL-AID ON SUNDAYS.
@ Tiger
hahahaha, a Shiite Christian, hahahahahahaha. That RULES.
lol, it's the fastest growing religion in the whole wide world!!!
You RULE! Very good points! Exactly what I was talking about...'end times'?? Every generation/religion has their end times. Didn't rastas think it was 1977? To name just one example.
Wanna come hang with me and my alpaca? I'm sure J-Boo wouldn't mind. We have bible study NEVER...
Steve... I know this is long, but please read it.
actually, no I"m talking about the Christian church in China, Indonesia, the Middle East, etc. Christians are literally being murdered everyday for their faith, but through the work of the underground churches, people are coming to Christ every day as well. I have connections with this information through various missionaries stationed in these countries. And what you said about Muslim becoming the fastest growing religion, you are correct. That is part of the problem. Most of the Muslim people I know about are against and hate Christians; why do you think Christians are being killed in these other countries? Because of a religion that tells them they need to wipe out God's people. I know of many who are the nicest people you could imagine, but there are the ones that make the entire religion look bad. I have heard stories from missionaries that former Muslims tell them of how they were threatened with death if they leave the faith, and some that were killed for converting to Christianity.
I just read an email I got from a friend in California that states that a couple in San Diego was forced to stop having a home Bible Study because some other people didn't like that they had 10 people over once a week to discuss the Bible. Discrimination?
How do you account for honest to goodness miracles if you don't believe in God? A woman at my church in AZ has an amazing testimony. She was diagnosed with stage 4 brain cancer that was inoperable and unresponsive to treatment, so she stopped all treatment. She went in for a check up to see how she was doing and to find out if it was growing, and none of the tests showed any tumor anywhere. It disappeared-miraculously. How do you account for the people who are in terrible car accidents and should be dead because of the way things happened or the way the car ends up practically flat, yet these people walk away with nothing more than bruises? How do you account for those "near misses" that had it been even half a second sooner, you'd be dead or seriously injured? Have you even watched the sunrise? Sunset? Have you ever seen the Northern Lights? Have you ever been to the Grand Canyon? Getting past the gay issue because it's obvious we are never going to agree, I'm just trying to figure out how anyone can go through life witnessing the above and still not believe in God. I don't need evidence that Jesus existed, I have the Bible and a million other ways that I KNOW God is there. Starting with my birth and difficult heart surgery that followed. The reason I follow my pastor is because he is a well-educated Biblical Studies man, and when he is teaching a lesson or preaching a sermon, everything makes sense. He puts the scriptures into context and explains them and he backs them up with other sources, and they all make sense. He knows what he is talking about. We need pastors to help us grow in our faith and help us understand. I have seen your pictures on your myspace page, it's obvious you have some strong hate for Christian people. Why can't YOU accept that there are people who have those beliefs, rather than doing exactly what you claim I am doing by "hating." It's much more obvious that you have that hate when I look at those pictures, and I get the feeling that you wish Christianity would disappear. At least I don't go around photographing gay people and gay symbols and such and displaying them with the hate I see on your pictures towards Christians. You seem to think I "hate" gay people, but it's obvious you are harboring much more hate than I ever could manage. If this is not true, why those pictures?
Even without talking about the gay issue, I am fed up with how everyone scofs on the idea of Christianity, someone else's beliefs. I am tired of hearing about how just because we have our own beliefs and values that we "hate" a specific group of people and then get mad at us when we turn around and say that we are being hated for our beliefs. Apparently it's okay for you to have your own views, but woe to anyone who disagrees with you. I know this has gotten way off topic, but I am trying to make a point that you don't seem to think it's okay for us to not vote for gay marraige just because we don't believe in it. Would you want to be bullied into voting for something you didn't believe in, say having a course in Creationism required for every high school student? (But it wouldn't be required to take evolution). Would you vote for that? That's the way it is here. Everyone has to take science in high school, where they teach evolution, but heaven forbid anyone utter a peep about Creationism. My cousin got an F on a paper because he had to write what he believed about evolution, and he wrote that he couldn't because he didnt' believe in it, he only believed in Creation and to write about evolution would be violating his beliefs. Do you think that was fair that he was being forced to write about something he didn't believe in? Let's turn it around and say that your son / daughter had to write about Creationism and they failed because they said they couldn't because they dont' believe in it.
Okay, I know Steve probably thinks I'm rambling again, sorry, but I will close with this thought: if we all had the same beliefs, we'd be awfully boring. But when someone else is criticizing and insulting and calling names because of opposing viewpoints, that's where the line is crossed. Every post I see that is for gay rights seriously criticizes/ insults people of faith with opposing viewpoints. And THAT is the point I have been trying to make with all my posts. Treat me and my views with respect and I will do the same with yours.
First off, I've been to the Grand Canyon, and I never once thought that some dude put it there. That is a perfect example of evolution, can't you see it in the layers of rock? Do you know what is in those layers of rock? Fossils, to name one thing, from millions of years ago, as in before christ. Read a book on biology( 'Your Inner Fish' by Neil Shubin is a great, quick read, and it has nothing to do with debunking god) instead of the same bible everyday. I read a lot of the bible, why can't you read one book having nothing to do with the bible? Ah, I'll get off that subject. How about the Northern Lights? God made those? Why did he make them seen only in polar regions? Ben Franklin theorized the shifting lights to a concentration of electrical charges in the polar regions intensified by the snow and other moisture. Yeah, just a theory, but a pretty good one at that. And did you know that the rising and setting sun was a basis for the bible and pretty much every other religion. Google 'Horus' because I don't feel like typing it all out here. I could list off at least 5-10(or more) so called Gods that all were born on Dec. 25th to a virgin, 12 disciples, killed, resurrected, etc. and these were before the bible was even being made up, er, written.
How do you account for the millions of people who die each year because of cancer, car accidents, suicide bombings? If someone is not looking one way and pulls out in front of a car and gets killed, is that gods way of saying "you should have been more aware"?
And what about viruses? Have you ever had the flu or any other virus? Did you take medicine for it? If you did, you shouldn't have, because viruses evolve to stay alive and become bigger and better than when they first started, kind of like how we became walking, talking humans. So next time you get a virus, you better pray it away, because there is no Tamaflu for you.
@ Lisa
Any pictures that I have on my myspace page that make fun of Christians is just that, to make fun of a group of people who use their belief in a mythological god and want the rest of us to believe it as well. You can believe as you wish. All I am asking is that you not try to force that belief on me. I really do not care that you are a Christian, but I care when Christians want to use their beliefs as the basis for what I do or do not do. When they want is to make that belief law.
As for voting on gay marriage. I do not think you or anyone should vote on gay marriage. I do not think it should have even been on the ballot in the first place. It should not be an issue that is decided by votes. Civil rights should not be voted on. Civil rights should be granted to all - not decided by the people. The Constitution is there to protect "the people" from the majority.
As for your friend who wrote you about some bible study not being allowed to meet. If this was at a house, then I agree with you, that is bullshit. They should be allowed to meet in their homes, churches or,damn, the park for that matter (assuming it is a small group and not a church meeting) and have a bible study. Now, that is assuming that there is not much more to the story, which I would bet there is, (ie: 15 cars parked outside the house and an association rule against such gatherings/parties). In my neighborhood, there is an $1800 fine if you have a party that violates the noise ordinance. Trust me, it does not have to be a raging teenager's party either. I know of several people who have received the fine for pool parties with adults and kids in attendance. Not that this bible study in question was loud, but I bet there were other grounds for not allowing it. However, if it was simply that they are not allowed to meet to study, then I will fight that fight with you.
Now medical miracles. Oh my, why is it that many of these 'miracles" happen in countries with advanced medical treatments? Why is it that non-Christians have these same things happen to them? Why is it that a man can be drunk off his ass and get into a car accident, kill a van-full of kids and walk away himself unharmed? Is that a grand miracle? How about God curing an amputee? That would get me to think twice about my lack of belief in your god. How do you explain a Muslim who has the same testimony as your friend does? How do you explain the atheist who is cured of his sickness?
As for Christians in other countries being killed. First, you help to make my point about religion - the killing is being done by religious people, not those who lack a belief. Now, I must say that if I was a believer and someone came along and tried to get one of my loved ones to fall away from our belief system and essentially send them to hell, I would want to stop that at any cost. If a Muslim kills a Christian (or a Christian kills a Muslim, as we have done in the Middle East for decades via our imperialism) then it is to protect their loved ones from hell, in their opinions. They believe they are killing an agent of Satan. If an atheist went to those regions you talked about and tried to get Muslims to stop believing in a god, then they would be persecuted just as much as Christians are.
Now to the miracles of our natural world. Sunrise, sunset and Grand Canyon. Um, we know why the sun does those things. We know how the Grand Canyon was formed. Just because people lack the desire or ability to learn how and why something happens, does not mean that some invisible man did it. It is always amazing to me how lack of education goes hand-in-hand with belief in a god (obviously there are exceptions to this rule, but the statistics show that those without a college education have a higher rate of belief in a god).
Testing. Um, if someone gets an F on a science test, that is their fault. To take a test on evolution does not mean that you have to believe it. I have taken religion classes and I was able to answer the questions according to what the text says. I did not put, "JC did not exist, this question is stupid." If my kid was forced to learn about a religious belief system and creationism (there are many different versions of creationism: young earth, old earth and at least 4 others that I know of), I would expect my kid to take the test and answer the question according to the text. That does not mean that they have to believe it. In law school, I had to argue many sides of an argument that I did not agree with. I can make a very persuasive argument against Roe vs. Wade - not that I would agree with my argument, but I can stump most people and get them to agree with me that Roe vs. Wade should be overturned (again, not my actual opinion). It is all about critical thinking, which much of America lacks. Not to mention that our sons, Aidan and Shea, who just finished 6th grade, had an 8-page section in their World History books this year about Jesus. They did not show up the day of the test and put "I don't believe that Jesus existed, so I am not going to answer these questions," they read the 8 pages, learned the material that the text book company decided was worthy of being in a World History book and answered the questions accordingly. Frankly, your friend was not thinking clearly the day he decided to try to make a statement about evolution. He wasn't taking a test about his personal beliefs, he was being quizzed on whether he read & studied the material or not. Perhaps he just wasn't prepared for the test???
Lastly, I do not hate Christians for being Christians. I hate people who want to hold others down. Those people can be religious or non-religious. Religion is a plague on our civilization, but that is separate from why I stand up against bigotry.
@ Tiger
No Tamaflu for you - LOL, I want a shirt that says that.
@ Lisa
To follow up with Horus, check out Hercules as well. JC jacked his story also. Virgin birth of a god and human, killed, resurrected to live with his dad on Mt. Olympus, oh and so many more.
Steve, wasn't Horus the 'son/sun' god during the day, but when the sun went down, there was a 'dark god', or devil? So a better shirt would be: "No tamaflu and no going outside after dark' shit, that list could go on and on, fill up the whole tee shirt, haha. 'No homosexuality, but please, cut off part of your penis, and, see that group over there that looks and behaves almost exactly like us? Kill 'em.'
Ok, creative tee shirt time is over. lol.
@ Steve and Tiger...
I wasn't talking about HOW the sunrises/ sets, how the grand canyon got there, etc. I was talking about the beauty of it. I don't see how anyone can see that beauty and not believe in God. But I don't want to "force my beliefs on you" so I won't say anymore on that subject. I would like to see this history book that your sons had to read. I have NEVER seen a school text book with anything about Jesus in it. That's awesome that there really is one. I want my future children reading that one. What did it talk about? And my cousin was being quizzed about his beliefs; the exact wording of the question was "What do YOU BELIEVE about evolution?" Since he does not believe in it, that is what he wrote. That he does not believe evolution exists, but Creation, therefore, he failed. He failed because he does not believe in it. If the question were: what have you learned about evolution, he could have written what the text said. I'll never forget that question because I was so appalled that he would fail because of that. Again, we're off topic, but thank you for making your point without calling me names.
"I was talking about the beauty of it...I don't see how anyone can see that beauty and not believe in God."
I'm sorry but that leads me to believe you are certifiable.
I tried to say it as nice as I could.
@ Lisa
First, they are done with school (A track) so they do not have their books anymore. I am going to see if they can find a friend that is still on track so that I can take a pic of the 6 or 7 pages that talked about Jesus, Moses and a few others.
Second, about the beauty. I ask you again, wouldn't a Muslim or one of the thousands of other religions say that their god created all those things. I mean, that does nothing to prove the existence of the Christian god.
Third, If your cousin was asked what do you believe about evolution, then that is a stupid question. I cannot imagine any real science teacher phrasing a question like that. Any real science teacher who actually understood the topic would not phrase a question like that. No science teacher would use the word believe in relation to evolution because belief does not come in to play when discussing that topic. So either, that teacher does not truly understand evolution and science or is just an idiot or your cousin just failed or the story has been molded somewhere along the lines to fit into the apologist christian talking points (not necessarily by you). So in short, if that teacher really asked "what do you believe about evolution" then they should be fired, simply for the fact that they must be an idiot for phrasing a question in such a way that belief was brought into science. The only people I have ever heard who use belief and science together are religious people when talking about science being a belief system. Real scientist do not view it as a belief system, so that question would have never be posed by a real scientist.
Fourth, if your cousin was asked what do you believe, then all he had to do was answer it. There is not right or wrong answer to a question about belief. So even if your cousin was asked that question (which again, does not make any sense in a science class) then to get an F he would have had to really not made any sense or again, that story has been molded to fit apologist points.
NOW, how about your respond to some of my questions. I seem to respond to all of your questions and you seem to skip mine and move on to the next topic or point you want to make.
So please read my comment above and respond to the points I made, if you can. Feel free to give your pastor/leader the web address, I would love to discuss this with him. That is if he can handle it. I will go easy on him, I promise. I will even capitalize god and christian out of respect for him, if he comes (all though I do not have much respect for those who make a living off the back of working folks.)